Dip me in chocolate and throw me to the lesbians

[summer_jackel]

So, I'm going to vent a bit of frustration regarding gender stuff, because a couple of minor things that happened this week irritated me and are still nagging. I know I'm preaching to the choir, but it would be really cool if people regularly noticed and made efforts to curb gender biases as they crop up, at least the really obvious ones.



The first incident was at the feed store and involved me directly. I'd just loaded 2 40-lb sacks of feed into my truck, when a store employee who was walking behind me said, "wow, you really manhandled those bags!" There was a point in my life (ok, so most of it) where I'd have just ignored him completely, but something in me was in a toothy mood, and without thinking much about it I snapped, "or woman-handled as the case may be." He said something I don't remember; I told him that I didn't think my gender had anything to do with my ability to load feed and hissed off.

I will note that I'm not exactly a frail-looking woman. I have three horses, four dogs, four cats (with two feline guests, groan) and a housefull of miscellaneous little critters that get feed in heavy bags, so I lug around what amounts to probably a couple hundred pounds of feed a month. Still, tossing a couple of bags of dog food in a car is not exactly a stunning feat of strength and masculinity.

The second was a brief observation I made of a guy who seemed like the dad playing with 2 small children, a boy and a girl. Dad was throwing a foam football to the boy, who seemed a little nervous about catching it.
The girl said something about wanting to play with the ball; dad kind of dismissively told her to be the cheerleader and re-focused his attention on the boy. Obviously this was a very brief glimpse into the lives of people I don't know at all; arrogant of me to judge and all that. Maybe the girl really likes to play cheerleaders and dad lavishes focused playtime free of gender stereotypes on her all the time, but this seemed like such a groaningly-bad caricature of gender stereotype that it should be painful and obvious even to, I don't know, my chickens. Like, the really dumb little pullets I have right now who can't even figure out how to get in and out of the coop half the time. Come on, dude, those kids look barely school-age and playing with balls is good for their gross motor skills regardless of gender.

(This also reminded me of how REALLY GLAD I am not to be around small kids much at all anymore. Sweet).

These are minor irritations in the grand scheme of things, but I'm glad in retrospect that I spoke up to feed store guy. I think most of us have at some point experienced a harmful gender or racial or whatever bias cropping up in our thinking by now. I try to keep an eye on mine and explore them when I find them. This just seems like routine 'I want to be a decent person' self-maintenance to me; I'm not particularly proud of it or anything. I have total compassion for having unexamined harmful cultural assumptions as long as the person is willing to reflect upon them when they are pointed out. Hopefully feed guy was utterly mortified by my challenge and is rethinking his ideas about gender right now. (You all knew I'm a stupidly, incurably romantic, right? The poetry gave it away)?

I will skip the whole line of reasoning that leads from these thoughts to contemplating National Coming-Out Day, which is tomorrow, October 11, and why it's so very important to be out and proud and/or supportive even in some small and quiet way. (Although if anyone wants more detail I will provide, because it's important).

I spent yesterday evening at a play in San Francisco* in the delightful company of a big group of friends that included all of my current sweethearts and most of their sweethearts (poly, when it works, can be really, really neat like that). The whole outing was lots of fun. I notice now how nice it was to be able to share mild public affection with my girlfriend without worrying about that becoming some kind of problem---and not to be thinking about it at the time. I'm pretty damned fortunate to inhabit such a public environment, and that is very recent and utterly precious social change.

So, rather bemusedly, (anyone hadn't noticed I was out?), here we go. For what very little it actually matters in 90% of my social functioning, I'm a cisgendered lesbian (for a definition of 'lesbian' that includes enjoying my male partner). I'm polyamorous and really happy about that. I do my best to divorce my gender identity from my ability to lug feed around, for that way lies madness, but I will confess an occasional flash of butch-y machismo about it. While we're on the subject, I don't identify particularly as butch or femme and you really don't have to ; that's one of those irritatingly challengeworthy stereotypes. I'll mention that I have my moments with both, it varies greatly and is mostly irrelevant, and leave it at that.

So there you go. As a statement it seems a little anticlimactic and pointless to me, but I guess it did take me a while to get here, this comfortable with it. I've enjoyed the privilege of experiencing very little violence of any kind around gender, which is another factor. Being out when you can and noticing cultural stupidity around gender stuff when it arises is a really good and important thing, and I think that's enough politics from me for a good while.


______________

*The play was Jerry Springer, the Opera, and it was all kinds of fun and awesome. It is a beautiful, vulgar, insightful piece of theater. My friend Becca has the part of Baby Jane in it, and all the performances are stellar. If any of you are local-ish and want to see a play in the city this week, go see!

Comments

[redknot.livejournal.com]

I don't identify particularly as butch or femme and you really don't have to; that's one of those irritatingly challengeworthy stereotypes. I'll mention that I have my moments with both, it varies greatly and is mostly irrelevant, and leave it at that.

Well said. I especially like the phrase "it varies greatly and is mostly irrelevant"... seems applicable to so many things ;)

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

Thanks! And yeah, so much of my gender/sexuality/whatev varies quite a bit and really is totally irrelevant to most of the people and situations I encounter. I'd really like to live in a society where people cared a lot less about the gender, orientation, etc. of folks who they weren't in relationship with.

[agoutirex.livejournal.com]

Just out of morbid curiosity, what verb would you have prefered to "manhandle?" I can't really think of one offhand that means the same thing without any gender assumptions in it.

[teahound.livejournal.com]

This, honestly. I thought it just meant, 'wow, you handled those capably!' not, 'wow, you handled those like a man!'

Not saying your ire is/was necessarily unwarranted, just that they could have been like many of us who don't notice the gender implication of every common phrase.

[leora.livejournal.com]

To me, the word "manhandled" means to handle something roughly. It has absolutely nothing to do with gender though anymore than "grass" has anything to do with "ass", just because one is a subset of the other word.

It is ~not~ a compliment though.

It isn't necessarily a bad thing. Some things can be manhandled without damage, but you wouldn't want to do it to anything potentially breakable. Manhandling packages when you don't know the contents is a real problem.

I think the more likely cause for offense here is the dictionary listing synonyms as "maul", "mistreat", and such. Although I wouldn't always mean "manhandle" in a purely negative light.

I do wonder how many people mean a gender component when they say "manhandle", it probably varies by location and other attributes. But the guy who said it may have been had no gender implication intended at all - or might have. I don't know.

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

I realize looking back at my post that I was unclear about an important detail. At the time, it seemed to me that the subtext of what "feed store guy" was saying was that he found it unusual for a woman to be hauling feed around, and that the tone of his comment wasn't necessarily a compliment or positive thought. The other thing that he said that I can't quite remember was something to the effect of 'women aren't usually that strong'---it was something about gender specifically, and that's what rankled me most.

I don't feel that a customer loading a couple bags of dog food into a truck is worthy of commentary at a feed store. If he was looking for an excuse to talk to me, he could have chosen the weather or anything else. I think, however, that if he'd really felt the need to have this conversation, I'd have preferred something along the lines of "wow, you handle that feed with skill," "I'm impressed by how strong you are," or "dude, you load that feed like someone who works here...cool!" No need to point out that I'm a woman or use a word that has fairly negative connotations. But like I said, I don't think he meant, necessarily, to compliment me.

Not that 'manhandling' is an inappropriate term for bucking feed around or that I'm completely opposed to using the word. I haven't stricken it (or manhole, fireman, manhours, etc.) entirely from my vocabulary, although I do think that there are gender implications in those terms that need to be examined and changed. My problem here was that the guy saw a woman handling feed competently (something that happens all the time there, I'm sure) found it unusual and decided to comment in a way that came out a bit nonplussed.

[leora.livejournal.com]

Ah, that makes sense. Context is important. Sorry that sounds annoying. :/

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

Heh, you aren't annoying, and context IS important. This is what I get for writing a post that became more in-depth than I originally intended, while pedaling my trainer.

I will try to be more precise the next time...although it would be nice if there wasn't a next time, and all of the culture's subtle gender-fail just kind of healed itself...oh...now would be nice.

[leora.livejournal.com]

I meant the original experience with the guy sounded annoying.

On the other hand, My sister just took me shoe shopping... I now have formal shoes. I am closer to ready for my trip.

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

ooh, nice! I'm sure you'll look lovely, and I hope that your trip is really wonderful.

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

Apropos of nothing, Agoutirex, you and the ferret would absolutely _love_ 'Jerry Springer, the Opera.' I know it's a long way to the city for you, but...you guys would totally appreciate its humor and depth.

[tenaya-owlcat.livejournal.com]

Thank you for posting this... I always appreciate being able to know my friends a bit better, and it's a good reminder to be more mindful of my speech.

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

Most welcome, and glad that you found my rant interesting.

[archteryx.livejournal.com]

Well, at least to me, you're just...summer jackel. Maybe a bit naive, but true. :)

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

That's certainly what I prefer, particularly among my friends. Every now and again I experience the need to come up teeth about certain pervasive cultural problems; this almost never occurs with people who know me socially.

[stoda.livejournal.com]

While there are genetically established differences that tend to reinforce many gender stereotypes... some people seem to feel terribly threatened when they discover shades of grey.

Love is hard enough to find in this world... and I've got a great long rant but I'm really awfully tired, and I'd be preaching to the choir.

Cisgendered is a new word to me. And to the spellchecker, apparently. Heh. Funny that we'd need a word for being comfortable in your own skin, but given the number of words for NOT being that way, well... I guess it deserves equal time, or something.

Give people, love, life, peace, all a chance.

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

I really like 'cisgendered' for a lot of reasons; having cis be so pervasively the norm that there wasn't even a word for it underscores perfectly, I think, the poignancy and sorrow of a lot of trans experience----furthermore, though, and more directly relevant to me is that there wasn't a word for something pretty central to my experience!

Physically female with a female gender identity is too much of a mouthful, especially for such a common experience. Cisgendered is just easier, and gives me something to self-identify as that isn't unconsciously devaluing someone else's gender experience. :) I think that there are more shades of grey than anything else.

[martes.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't be upset about 'manhandled.' It's a word, like 'manpower,' 'manhours,' and similar words. It's a specific description of an action, that can be used with men, women or children, and has lost any gender connotations it might have had.

The dad with the kids is a whole different can of worms. No comment on that.

[feuervogel]

I disagree.

That people believe that explicitly gendered words like mankind, man-hours, chairman, fireman, manpower, and mailman have lost gender connotations is just another drop in the bucket of normalizing Male as default and marking everything else as Other.

Language is important.

[phineus.livejournal.com]

Language is important, and it's easy to forget the meanings in things. Take "lame," for example.

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

I'm not necessarily opposed to the use of these gendered terms, at least in all contexts; I don't want to get too bogged down in unnecessary political correctness. By the same token, I do think that the words are to some degree a problem, and use alternatives when I can. It's a minor change, but I can make it so I do.

I realized after I wrote the post (see comment above) that I hadn't mentioned that feed store guy explicitly said something, I cannot recall exactly what, about how he thought it was unusual that a woman could handle feed as I was handling it. That and his attitude, more than the use of 'manhandle' is what really irritated me about the interaction and made it very clear that his comment had to do with gender and not, for instance, complimenting me on my feed handling skills. I'll admit the incident was petty, but it stuck with me.

...the thing with the kids just sucked, but alas I can't exactly say anything about it to the dad.

[saigh-allaidh.livejournal.com]

I feel your pain. And I, for one, do have issues with the idea of "manhandled" and the like having nothing to do with gender. Because in my mind, in my studies, the implications of such terms losing gender meaning reinforces the concept that male is the "default" gender. I also have a real problem with the idea of male sizing being "unisex" for the same reason.

The thing with the dad and the kids really irks me. It makes me want to carry copies of Dowling's The Frailty Myth and hand it out when I see that sort of thing (but, you know, I can't afford as many copies as I'd need even if I don't go out that often). The reason why girls are still behind in sports, although catching up quick, is because of the delay in exposure...because dad's play catch with boys and not with girls at an age when those motor skills are developing the best. grrr...grumble...growl

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I couldn't exactly do anything about the situation with the dad and the kids, but it hurt to see.

It's the 'male as default' or 'normal' or whatever judgment comes of that that disturbs me about these gendered words. I realize this is a fairly minor point where the culture could use change compared to some, and I haven't excised all of these words from my own usage---but I'm aware of it and I try. And, as I've mentioned in comments above, I wasn't necessarily clear enough in my initial post that in this brief interchange with the feed store guy, he made it clear that it was the novelty or whatever of a woman moving feed around (honestly, I don't think it's that novel...) that he was commenting on. Growl.

Three-nippled cousin fucker!

[kynekh-amagire.livejournal.com]

I'd really like to live in a society where people cared a lot less about the gender, orientation, etc. of folks who they weren't in relationship with.

This like crazy. I'm hesitant to even approach this subject, because I find that for the purposes of almost any conversation about gender identity, gender expression, sexual preference, sexual orientation, or sexual practice, I'm "just not _____ enough". Not gay enough, not straight enough, not bi enough, not butch enough, not femme enough, not trans enough, not cis enough, etc. etc. etc., and I just get frustrated with all the boxes I don't quite fit into. Which is kind of my issue to deal with, but I can't help feeling that if this was a less gender-policing society, maybe the subject wouldn't keep coming up so goddamned consistently.

Raah raah. With that said, as a retail employee in a "guy stuff" coded department, I get to hear "isn't there a man who can do that?" with depressing consistency. Dear everyone-at-large: breasts don't actually have any effect on my ability to lift heavy shit, my ability to assemble patio furniture, or the amount of knowledge I'm capable of storing about lawnmowers. Kindly sit down and THINK for a few minutes if that information strikes you as threatening or confusing.

Re: Three-nippled cousin fucker!

[summer-jackel.livejournal.com]

I think that the specter of 'not ______ enough' haunts a lot of people, myself included. At some point, I think I decided that if 'label X' attracted a person and they started to use it and create an (internal or external) dialog with it, then it was certainly no right of mine to decide that the label didn't apply---although if their use then inspired or stirred something in me (positive or otherwise) I should definitely examine that.

These labels are all so imprecise; my "lesbian" might resemble your "lesbian" (if you even want to use the term) in the same way Bliss resembles Rooster, or even Luck...they're both technically collies...But. Nonetheless, I think I've fine-tuned my understanding and (hopefully) sensitivity towards people (and myself?) by exploring these words and how they mean things. It's kinda cool, and an ongoing process, anyway.

Not that there's any subtlety in the issue of "isn't there a MAN who can do that?" No idea how you don't just deck people.

[smile-n-cuddle.livejournal.com]

Thanks for pointing out gender stereotypes. I sometimes feel too distracted to notice anymore, but I think they are important enough that I should notice them more often. I appreciate your thoughts :)

And I'm glad you have found a social circle that is so very supportive of *you*! Do you feel you have moved on from your prior relationship into a new set of normal life? I feel this only recently, and I so often think of you and wonder how you are doing :)